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 Train control with RCS system

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PostSubject: Train control with RCS system   Sat May 30, 2009 10:29 pm

I was in search of a radio control for garden railway.
Looking the miscellaneous manufacturer websites, it seems no one is willing to define the basic specifications of their proposals.
For knowing the capabilities of the systems, it seems the only way is to analyse the gore details of the manuals.
Also, being in Europe, the number of systems complying with radio regulation is limited.
I was interested by the Australian RCS system, who is no better than his competitors in presenting its materials.
I've decided to draft a schematic to understand how it was working, which have helped me a lot.
So, here are these schematics and specifications in a more polished version than my initial draft. Enjoy!
Please note that I do not own (yet) the system, these info are only taken from RCS documents.
I am not involved in RCS business and it shall be clear that I cannot guaranty anything at all.

Yet, I am awaiting impatiently comments of RCS about theses drawings (shown here : http://rouzeau.net/Technique/GardenRailwayRCS)















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Carl Hibbs
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Location : Haute Normandie - visitors welcome

PostSubject: Re: Train control with RCS system   Sun May 31, 2009 6:06 am

I have been very impressed with the RCS system and have a few friends here in France who use this system.

They (Tony Walsham and co) are very helpful and knowledgeable about all things train control.

Your excellent illustrations are very useful to explain how it all works as the RCS information itself can be a little daunting.

Have you shown these to RCS?

I don't use the full train control system although that could change in the future.

I have two RCS speed controller (throttle) units for use with conventional radio control waiting to be used on future projects.
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Bearcastle



Location : Brie

PostSubject: Re: Train control with RCS system   Sun May 31, 2009 8:48 am

I think you should look at the last "hors série" of "Loco Revue" it has all the latest news about the "commande numérique".

They show and compare a lot of brand and the fact that you could mixed some equipment at some point, when they follow the rule (norme).

I am looking at Massoth and ESU, there's as well some equipment not selling in France that are looking promissing.

They talked as well about the control of all the circuit from a computer and the compatibility with brand like ESU.

I like that bit, because you could take control of all your point and make several train running at the same time.
That what i was doing few year ago at the SNCF, it was my first job there, i was working in traffic box.
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PostSubject: Re: Train control with RCS system   Sun May 31, 2009 9:03 am

I've sent the info to RCS around 10 days ago, along with other comments on his system, via the contact box on his site.
Having no answer, I've expedited at the begining of this week by same mean, with also an alternative e-mail address. I was expecting a quick answer, but as I didn't get it, I decided to publish on forum.

I especially don't know if the live steam SD-10 is available, and also what is the shipping cost to France.

I have done this work because I think the RCS sysetm is quite clever but really, it needs specification and a more general doc if he wants to sell it. Plus the distribution is limited. He have a reseller in UK, but shipping from UK is ostly and they are not in Euro zone. Probably better to ship directly from Australia. And you get some chance not paying the duties if the parcel is small.
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Bearcastle



Location : Brie

PostSubject: Re: Train control with RCS system   Sun May 31, 2009 11:01 am

I agree it looks impressive. It's just that if you want later to improve it or change some bit it might be better to think local as europe is leading the market on it.

In the magazine there's some talks about it. All the installation is costly in the end because each machine and some wagons need some equipment as your tracks and points.

So as you didn"t built anything yet take your time, compare and see what's going on this market.

As well you could simulate your train line with some of the software.

I saw lots of garden train line now and they all have one common things, it's start on a corner and improve and grow on another. So most of the time you have your first line becoming the old one with new addition.


Last edited by Bearcastle on Sat Jun 06, 2009 6:40 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: Train control with RCS system   Sun May 31, 2009 11:32 am

One point which have driven me to their system is the live steam.
Traditionnal R/C command seems not appropriate. I already own a Graupner MC12 but frankly I don't think it as very practical. Though the availability of RCS live steam system is not yet confirmed.

Maybe Europe is leading DCC market, but is it the way to go for garden trains ?
I do not intend to have a very wide network nor an automated one.

About the cost for track point/accessories, if a radio receiver does not cost much more than a DCC decoder, where is the extra-cost ?

I've read a thread on a US forum about the aristocraft 'Revolution', was quite interesting and also helped me to understand the problems. And for sure they are not ready to deliver a live steam receiver.

I have thought anyway, to have different system for driving the locos and the accessories. That seems thinkable because this is different stuff and different problems. Distributing DCC via a feeder intead of the track solve many problems.

I'll have a look on this magazine.
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Carl Hibbs
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Location : Haute Normandie - visitors welcome

PostSubject: Re: Train control with RCS system   Sun May 31, 2009 6:56 pm

Now a system that can control live steam locomotives - transmitter, receiver, servo that is also compatible with controlling battery powered locomotives and...analogue track power really interests me.

One or a few indentical small handheld transmitters instead of the traditiononal monster car/aircraft/boat things would be a real advancement.
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PostSubject: Re: Train control with RCS system   Sun May 31, 2009 9:19 pm

I am running my railway using Massoth DCC for both loco control and point operation. I would be very pleased if my lone steam loco could also be controlled using DCC to replace the radio controller.
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GWhizz



Location : Charente, France

PostSubject: Re: Train control with RCS system   Mon Jun 01, 2009 8:03 pm

Geoff

If I'm not mistaken, your live steamer is two channel r/c?

Can you not use a MASSOTH 8156001 DiMAX Motor/Switch decoder which has two motor control outputs to drive two servo's ???

I've not done it! But it should be possible?

Anyone out there with enough technical expertise to advise??????

_________________
Brian
Brian
also blogging at
www.frenchgardenrailways.com
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PostSubject: Re: Train control with RCS system   Fri Jun 05, 2009 8:58 pm

I finally got an answer from RCS, the mail was not going through Sad
Two main comments:
1/ Track receiver current is filtered and is ok for DCC locos (that's not what is written on the docs)
2/ The live steam receiver SD-10 shall most probably be never produced again.
From mail of RCS, it have been killed by the 2.4 GHz radio, which have a much better range. He says that the power of the RCS transmitter is unsufficient to improve the range. This is most probably due to difficulties to have a good reception in the live steam metallic locos.
This is pityful because the RCS system was the only one being able to handle either live steam, battery loco or analogic track.
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Carl Hibbs
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Location : Haute Normandie - visitors welcome

PostSubject: Re: Train control with RCS system   Fri Jun 05, 2009 9:44 pm

That is a great shame.

I may write directly to Tony as it sounds like he maybe winding things down a bit.

Thanks for keeping us informed Pierre.
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PostSubject: Re: Train control with RCS system   Sat Jun 06, 2009 7:39 am

GWhizz wrote:
Geoff

If I'm not mistaken, your live steamer is two channel r/c?

Can you not use a MASSOTH 8156001 DiMAX Motor/Switch decoder which has two motor control outputs to drive two servo's ???

I've not done it! But it should be possible?

Anyone out there with enough technical expertise to advise??????

That sounds reasonable, I will have a try at that as soon as I get time.

Thanks for that.
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PostSubject: Re: Train control with RCS system   Fri Jun 12, 2009 9:22 pm

Hello, I got complementary infos about RCS live steam board.

The problem of the RCS live steam board SD-10 is that it was developed with an electronic circuit which is now deprecated. So continuing production needs to restudy it with new circuit like PIC. RCS considering that the market have diminished for live steam due to 2.4 GHz development have got other priorities.

I just see that Tony Walsham have registered on the forum, so he can give first hand infos.
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