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 Piko DB Railbus for sale

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philkelly



Location : Vienne, France and Islington. London

PostSubject: Piko DB Railbus for sale   Tue Sep 15, 2009 2:16 pm

I bought this with a view to bashing it (powering an Apocopa body) but it's too nice (and too wide!). It is analogue; has run about one metre on my UK test track and is in its box. Lowest new price I can find in ads is £286; so if anyone offers £275 (plus post at cost), it's their's. I'm putting it here first and will put it on the other channel if no takers - Ebay as a last resort. Post could be a bit - I don't know - and obviously more abroad; I can accept a French cheque too. PM me.



Phil
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French Chuffed



Location : Droitwich UK

PostSubject: Re: Piko DB Railbus for sale   Tue Sep 15, 2009 4:11 pm

Hi Phil, not to be a rivet counter but does this model represent a meter gauge original, or were they standard gauge?
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Carl Hibbs
Admin


Location : Haute Normandie - visitors welcome

PostSubject: Re: Piko DB Railbus for sale   Tue Sep 15, 2009 7:59 pm

The Uerdingen Railcars (VT95 and VT98 twin motored) were to my knowledge only ever built to standard gauge.

I was only looking a few weeks ago in a French railcar book and saw pictures of them on trial in eastern France.

However some were exported and built under licence in Spain like some French railcar makes.

I last saw these in service in Germany on the Düren Kreisbahn (not too far from Ralph Reppingen's).

So no they are not models of metre gauge prototypes. What is the actual scale I wonder if they are 'too wide'?
Although not in my budget they are very nice models and you will be hard pressed to buy a 2 car railbus anywhere for that money.
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philkelly



Location : Vienne, France and Islington. London

PostSubject: Re: Piko DB Railbus for sale   Tue Sep 15, 2009 10:16 pm

Carl is right: I think that German websites have the models down as a "compromise" 1:29 or thereabouts scale, so that a model of a standard gauge prototype does not look too out of place with 1:22.5 models - as it would if it were real G1, or 1:32. The real ones were all standard gauge. The model is 11cm wide. I don't have any LGB stock here to measure width, but the the roof line is noticeably lower than a standard LGB coach (some of which of course are models of 750mm, not metre gauge prototypes.) The scale does not not concern me too much. For example, if someone produced a 1:29 model of something like the FNC railcar, I would happily run it. The width makes them unsuitable to donate a chassis for the body I have, but they are not too wide to run on a normal G gauge railway.
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Paul Stainz Holt



Location : North Wales

PostSubject: Re: Piko DB Railbus for sale   Wed Sep 16, 2009 6:17 am

If someone on CGT does buy them, don't run them on a digital power supply until you have had them fitted with a decoder.
The motors aren't suitable for running on "zero" setting of Massoth/LGB DCC current and get very hot indeed.

Alec has a pair of that model which ran on my line for around half an hour
Obviously they are fine on analogue power.

Nice models too Smile

_________________
Excellent Austrian narrow gauge in North Wales.

Website http://linzgstadtbahn.webs.com/
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GWhizz



Location : Charente, France

PostSubject: Re: Piko DB Railbus for sale   Wed Sep 16, 2009 6:39 am

Motivated by seeing Phil's Apocopa French railbus resin shells, I was thinking of one myself and was tempted by the Piko Taurus units as a Donor chassis at 129 Euro new of German Ebay!

That would donate four axles on two bogies, I guess the prototypes were never built to such a configuration??

_________________
Brian
Brian
also blogging at
www.frenchgardenrailways.com
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Carl Hibbs
Admin


Location : Haute Normandie - visitors welcome

PostSubject: Re: Piko DB Railbus for sale   Wed Sep 16, 2009 7:28 am

Brian,

I would consider carefully about buying from Apocopa and I know them!

They make pretty accurate models of French railcars but the bare resin shells are very rough and need a lot of work.
I have one sat here (a Billard 150D6 Réseau Bréton) to do.
They can with attention and time (and some body filler) build into very good models.
Maarten Meuwes the Training Dutchman is probably the finest builder of French railcars. Have a look at his projects page.

I would not recommend buying a complete or even just a painted shell from Max. The quality of his finished work leaves much to be desired.

For motor bogies. It depends on what model you want but many people motorise the trailing bogie with the smaller Aristo units.

For a typical French metre gauge branch line a Billard 80D is a must, everyone had them.
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Carl Hibbs
Admin


Location : Haute Normandie - visitors welcome

PostSubject: Re: Piko DB Railbus for sale   Wed Sep 16, 2009 9:12 am

Thinking about this a bit more.

Max charges 205€ for a bare shel plus 150€ painting and glazing fitted.
A completed model is 700€.

BTW, the Aristo motor bogie for a Billard 80 is ref; no. 29356 60mm wheelbase.

If you painted these Piko railcars red and cream, removed the double buffers and added a flat radiator grill they would look like something pretty French I reckon....!
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philkelly



Location : Vienne, France and Islington. London

PostSubject: Re: Piko DB Railbus for sale   Wed Sep 16, 2009 10:21 am

Carl Hibbs wrote:
Brian,

I would consider carefully about buying from Apocopa and I know them!

They make pretty accurate models of French railcars but the bare resin shells are very rough and need a lot of work.
I have one sat here (a Billard 150D6 Réseau Bréton) to do.
They can with attention and time (and some body filler) build into very good models.
Maarten Meuwes the Training Dutchman is probably the finest builder of French railcars. Have a look at his projects page.

I would not recommend buying a complete or even just a painted shell from Max. The quality of his finished work leaves much to be desired.

For motor bogies. It depends on what model you want but many people motorise the trailing bogie with the smaller Aristo units.

For a typical French metre gauge branch line a Billard 80D is a must, everyone had them.

Absoluely endorse that. Max uses acetone (nail varnish remover soluble) paints which chip when you look at them. The internal electrics (giving directional lights on analogue) also need to be completely rebuilt when installing a decoder and I am doing that again. My Billard started as a painted finished model (it looked good on the website and I was new to the game!) which has been repainted all over three times with acrylics, which can at least be touched up after inevitable bumps. The horns fell off and have been replaced with ship's horns from a model boat supplier (actually they look better). It is also patched up with model filler because it always comes off worst in accidents. The unpainted De Dion shell was a b****r needing lots of sanding to get the windows to fit but looks fine now - just the gearbox failed (Bachman railtruck) and will need rebuilding. Because there is no other supplier, I got an RS4 body (which is only supplied painted, has only been out of the box to be measured and already has chipped paint). I was looking for a four wheel, R1 capable, chassis - hence the purchase of the Piko railbus - which (see previous posts) is too wide (the RS4 body is only 9 cm wide). Were I to "francicise" the Piko, I would still need to motorise the RS4 and three projects on the go is enough! I have decided to cheat and motorise the RS4 with a power and a trailing bogie - hence the disposal of the Railbus.

But as Carl says, no French railway complete without one!
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philkelly



Location : Vienne, France and Islington. London

PostSubject: Re: Piko DB Railbus for sale   Wed Sep 16, 2009 10:51 am

GWhizz wrote:
Motivated by seeing Phil's Apocopa French railbus resin shells, I was thinking of one myself and was tempted by the Piko Taurus units as a Donor chassis at 129 Euro new of German Ebay!

That would donate four axles on two bogies, I guess the prototypes were never built to such a configuration??

Brian: The protopypes of the Billards that Max sells were either four axle/two bogies or (the A150 Carl mentions) six axle articulated round the centre bogie. Max's motorised versions use the Aristo block, but it is actually the "trailing" bogie that is motorised on the model - the power bogie had a longer wheelbase - dimensions I can give you from WJK Davies The Light Railway Railcar in Western Europe if you proceed. Be careful with a donor chassis. The A80 widebodied version (which I have) is only 8.5 cm wide internally and you may hit the same problem as I did with the Piko railbus!
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GWhizz



Location : Charente, France

PostSubject: Re: Piko DB Railbus for sale   Wed Sep 16, 2009 11:36 am

Thanks guys

Having read all the above it makes the Apocopa seem very unattractive. We did actually discuss the whys and wherefores at Phil's but I do still like the idea of a railcar.

Coming to the conclusion that Phil's Piko plus a few cans of red and cream spray paint is starting to look good value. How easy is the railbus to disassemble and remove the glazing Phil?

Depending on a couple of Corpets that have come up via GMad I may be pm'ing you again Phil,

_________________
Brian
Brian
also blogging at
www.frenchgardenrailways.com
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Carl Hibbs
Admin


Location : Haute Normandie - visitors welcome

PostSubject: Re: Piko DB Railbus for sale   Wed Sep 16, 2009 1:00 pm

For paint try Interfer available from Le Train Magique
Colours, rouge autorail IF701 and jaune autorail SNCF IF405, these are high quality water based acrylics.
The red is what I did Geoff's speeder in.
They also make solvent based (slightly denser, quicker drying) acrylics.

I had a look in my autorail books and there are many prototypes that have a passing resemblance to the Uerdingen types.
From the side with folding doors and bus windows they look a little like CFD/Montmirail railcars supplied to the CP but they were bogie vehicles.

The front looks a bit like some later twin axle Berliet types or a converted Schemia. You could bash them a bit by removing the folding doors and putting a large single door in place maybe.
And/or modify the front windows and make a small pigs nose half curved window that fits round the top of a stumpy fat radiator grill like a Billard.

Billard did produce some 4 wheel jobbies like the A65D for the Oise network.

I think they would look just great and some metre gauge railcars were an all over dark red, in Corsica in the 50's and too in Breton with the ABHs....

Getting a bit obsessive now..... Basketball
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pjti



Location : Galizano, nr Santander, Nth Spain

PostSubject: Re: Piko DB Railbus for sale   Wed Sep 16, 2009 2:08 pm

When I was in Dortmund this April I was checking out the local station when what trundled by but the very same VT98 as Piko make, I've captured it on video if anyone wants to see, only about 30secs tho.

BTW an interesting project for anyone with these would be the SINGLE axle bicycle trailer they sometimes towed.

_________________
Wake me up by noon please.

Patrick
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philkelly



Location : Vienne, France and Islington. London

PostSubject: Re: Piko DB Railbus for sale   Wed Sep 16, 2009 11:21 pm

Brian: would you mind terribly if I didn't try to get the windows out of the Railbus as I am trying to flog it in "as new" condition Shocked ? The instruction manual seems to indicate that they are a one-piece moulding which comes out after the body has been unclipped from the chassis, but I just used the instruction manual for my new car to change a light bulb and it took over two hours, so it's not always as easy as they make it look.

I used the colours Carl suggests on the De Dion - they would look better sprayed and the Railbus at least has smooth sides.

I will post some pics of a four wheel Billard tomorrow.

I posted pics of single axle trailers in Mikey's "How to make a railcar" thread; I am also looking at making one (b****r, that's four projects.) affraid
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GWhizz



Location : Charente, France

PostSubject: Re: Piko DB Railbus for sale   Thu Sep 17, 2009 6:39 am

philkelly wrote:
Brian: would you mind terribly if I didn't try to get the windows out of the Railbus

Thanks for considering it Phil, but with my Corpet purchase I don't have funds for a railbus at the mo!

In fact will be listing some stuff on Ebay later to help fund things - nothing of much interest here I suspect...

An 18volt Trafo
A dozen R1 Curves
Couple of red Playmo coaches
A blue/ cream DR passenger car
and an original "Feuriger Elias" Tram 102

_________________
Brian
Brian
also blogging at
www.frenchgardenrailways.com
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philkelly



Location : Vienne, France and Islington. London

PostSubject: Re: Piko DB Railbus for sale   Thu Sep 17, 2009 10:04 am

Same reason I'm getting rid of the railbus - but as promised, for interest's sake, some French fourwheelers:

Billard A50DL



Berliet (actually 2-A but four wheels would be ok on a model):



Saurer

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philkelly



Location : Vienne, France and Islington. London

PostSubject: Re: Piko DB Railbus for sale   Fri Sep 18, 2009 12:18 pm

Just received a sharp message on the other channel that these are going for £150/160 so will be dropping price!
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GWhizz



Location : Charente, France

PostSubject: Re: Piko DB Railbus for sale   Fri Sep 18, 2009 12:50 pm

philkelly wrote:
Just received a sharp message on the other channel that these are going for £150/160 so will be dropping price!

Don't believe everything you see and read over there, I think people are pricing just the motor unit!

_________________
Brian
Brian
also blogging at
www.frenchgardenrailways.com
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philkelly



Location : Vienne, France and Islington. London

PostSubject: Re: Piko DB Railbus for sale   Fri Sep 18, 2009 2:05 pm

Sold to Van anyway. A good home and best to deal with friends!
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GWhizz



Location : Charente, France

PostSubject: Re: Piko DB Railbus for sale   Fri Sep 18, 2009 3:00 pm

philkelly wrote:
Sold to Van anyway. A good home and best to deal with friends!

Well done to you both - look forward to seeing it running !

Will you be treating yourself to an extra humungous birthday present then Phil?

_________________
Brian
Brian
also blogging at
www.frenchgardenrailways.com
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fm12



Location : 87210 Haute Vienne, France

PostSubject: Re: Piko DB Railbus for sale   Fri Sep 18, 2009 3:08 pm

paul stainz holt wrote:
If someone on CGT does buy them, don't run them on a digital power supply until you have had them fitted with a decoder.
The motors aren't suitable for running on "zero" setting of Massoth/LGB DCC current and get very hot indeed.


Nice models too Smile




Thanks for the info Paul.
I`ll not take them out visiting,will just run them here on my analogue line(well when its laid/built)
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Carl Hibbs
Admin


Location : Haute Normandie - visitors welcome

PostSubject: Re: Piko DB Railbus for sale   Fri Sep 18, 2009 4:30 pm

I'm glad someone bought them here. Well done Van and thank-you....well my ageing credit card thanks you. silent I was very tempted myself.

If you ever feel like bashing them I would be happy to help with ideas, info and bits if necessary
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Carl Hibbs
Admin


Location : Haute Normandie - visitors welcome

PostSubject: Re: Piko DB Railbus for sale   Fri Sep 18, 2009 4:52 pm

philkelly wrote:
Just received a sharp message on the other channel that these are going for £150/160 so will be dropping price!

I saw that a helpful enthusiast wrote,

"2 new ones have sold in last couple of weeks for 160 and 165 so 250 seems steep."

Any person can make an unsubstantiated or provocative remark like that.

Is that 2 new ones together for between 160 and 165 or one at 160 and another at 165, and is that dollars, pounds, euros or pieces of eight?

Where, when, how, why are a few of the other unanswered questions one could pose if one hand the inclination.

I had a look round on the e bays and could find a handful on ebay.de
You can see for yourself, not much under the 300€ mark with several days to go.

VT95/98 on e bay

Even if you paid £250 Van I would say you still have a good value purchase and you know where it's been.


Last edited by Carl Hibbs on Fri Sep 18, 2009 5:05 pm; edited 2 times in total
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mikeyh



Location : Dordogne France

PostSubject: Re: Piko DB Railbus for sale   Fri Sep 18, 2009 5:03 pm

I think Van asked the guy to post that about the price. ~he was very quick off the mark. Laughing

Mikey
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Carl Hibbs
Admin


Location : Haute Normandie - visitors welcome

PostSubject: Re: Piko DB Railbus for sale   Fri Sep 18, 2009 5:06 pm

mmmmm....
Looks like the chappie who made that comment is quite a forum dealer. He had a NIB one for sale/sold one recently himself. I wonder if it sold for £160...
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