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 RC/battery for LGB Stainz. Some advice anyone?

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KleineDicke




PostSubject: Re: RC/battery for LGB Stainz. Some advice anyone?    Thu Jan 06, 2011 9:58 pm

Actually to isolate track power from battery power, you only need a SPDT (single pole double throw) switch; the center off position isn't really needed either. On many LGB locos, you can't easily isolate one side of the track power with switches and wires anyway. But since there is generally little difference in price, a DPDT will work as well. Reversing the polarity does require a DPDT - with or without center off.

I agree with Carl's warning about sub-miniature switches. I also find it almost impossible for my old eyes and fat fingers to solder a wire cleanly to one.

4.90 euros is quite expensive indeed- even more expensive than RadioShack!

I am currently converting my Spreewald to use battery power from a trailer car. The power will be provided via a power jack which will open one of the contacts when the plug in inserted, thereby disconnecting the track power when the battery power plug is inserted (effectively a SPDT switch). I'll post some pictures when I finish the project.
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Carl Hibbs
Admin


Location : Haute Normandie - visitors welcome

PostSubject: Re: RC/battery for LGB Stainz. Some advice anyone?    Fri Jan 07, 2011 6:43 pm

Ah cheapskates......You can buy less expensive switches of course but these are high current and good quality items. Wink

I paid 2.50 for (a cheap?) one a while back and clumsily melted the solder tag block and the whole thing fell apart. But I do have some new specs now...... cyclops

If you want to use a SPDT switch then just 'common up' one side and if you are using a small switch with closely spaced connections it might even be better thus avoiding potential short circuits risks if the commoned side is kept away.




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pjti



Location : Galizano, nr Santander, Nth Spain

PostSubject: Re: RC/battery for LGB Stainz. Some advice anyone?    Fri Jan 07, 2011 7:13 pm

Carl, thanks, but how on earth do you tell good ones from bad ? Is it really all about price ? Especially as my local shop (ebay) has such a range (pricewise) to choose from. If I get some from Maplin they are probably chinese too.

_________________
Wake me up by noon please.

Patrick
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Paulus



Location : The Netherlands

PostSubject: Re: RC/battery for LGB Stainz. Some advice anyone?    Fri Jan 07, 2011 7:35 pm

The set from Hobbyking arrived today!!!!

It's not send from Germany, not send from the USA but from.....



Somehow I'm not surprised about this Wink
But I'm not complaining; it's way faster than the mentioned 45 days..


And here it is. Nothing fancy, no colorful box or styrofoam... uh... not even an user manual.
Just a plain white box with the transmitter and the receiver. But I'm still very happy with it!!



Ah well... perhaps there is a manual online somewhere...

Now waiting for the electronics. Hopefully they arrive soon also.

_________________
Paul pirat
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Carl Hibbs
Admin


Location : Haute Normandie - visitors welcome

PostSubject: Re: RC/battery for LGB Stainz. Some advice anyone?    Fri Jan 07, 2011 8:51 pm

pjti wrote:
Carl, thanks, but how on earth do you tell good ones from bad ? Is it really all about price ? Especially as my local shop (ebay) has such a range (pricewise) to choose from. If I get some from Maplin they are probably chinese too.

Very difficult to decide Patrick and I suppose comparative price from a reputable store is an indicator.

I had a look at your suppliers (UK ebay) and there is a vast selection, much more than ebay.fr.

I saw this one which looks identical to poorer quality ones I have previously bought with the solder contacts very close to edges and glued in place.
But it is very difficult to tell from a picture alone.
Cheap switch

In the 'good' old days when China's only export was rice there used to be well known manufacturers of these items like ITT, Ferranti and GEC and you knew it was reliable........ and made of Bakelite. Razz

Now you pay your money take your chance.



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Andrew



Location : Bomaderry, New South Wales, Australia

PostSubject: Re: RC/battery for LGB Stainz. Some advice anyone?    Fri Jan 07, 2011 9:07 pm

http://www.members.optusnet.com.au/satr/2point4GHz.htm
This is the installation and "how to" for the hobbyking. I copied it from Sandstone & Termite website. And if your reading this - Thanks Greg!
Regards Andrew
Sandbar & Mudcrab
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KleineDicke



Location : Deep in the Heart of Texas (Houston)

PostSubject: Re: RC/battery for LGB Stainz. Some advice anyone?    Fri Jan 07, 2011 9:20 pm

Andrew wrote:
http://www.members.optusnet.com.au/satr/2point4GHz.htm
This is the installation and "how to" for the hobbyking. I copied it from Sandstone & Termite website. And if your reading this - Thanks Greg!
Regards Andrew
Sandbar & Mudcrab

Not to be conceited or anything Embarassed, but I see Greg has included my conversion of the HK Remote Control to "Mode 3" with two throttle controllers.

_________________
Bill Wray

"It is one of the happiest characteristics
of this glorious country that official utterances are invariably
regarded as unanswerable."
-Sir Joseph Porter, First Lord of the Admiralty (HMS Pinafore)
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Andrew



Location : Bomaderry, New South Wales, Australia

PostSubject: Re: RC/battery for LGB Stainz. Some advice anyone?    Fri Jan 07, 2011 11:24 pm

O.K. Keep the great ideas coming as it grows our railways. Is anyone working on using the Hobbyking using an extra servo to activate the whistle sound? That would be handy for me using the mylocsound unit.
Regards Andrew
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pjti



Location : Galizano, nr Santander, Nth Spain

PostSubject: Re: RC/battery for LGB Stainz. Some advice anyone?    Tue Jan 11, 2011 9:58 am

As I am going to UK tomorrow for a few days I will probably get my bits from Maplin, I know they are more expensive than ebay but at least you can see what you are buying and hopefully will be of good quality. I still need to make a shopping list though.

Power and controller to be in trailer.

DPDT switches

A fuse of some sort - any ideas what rating for Stainz and quick or slow blow.

Connectors (trailer to engine) are DC plugs up to the job, what size ?

Battery holders.

Oh and whilst I am here, these Critter controls, does PWM mean they run at full voltage and just pulse to the motor a bit like DCC ?

_________________
Wake me up by noon please.

Patrick
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KleineDicke



Location : Deep in the Heart of Texas (Houston)

PostSubject: Re: RC/battery for LGB Stainz. Some advice anyone?    Tue Jan 11, 2011 3:07 pm

A Stainz should draw less than one amp, and a short a whole lot more. Something around 2 amps should do. I suggest using a 'polyswitch' for your circuit breaker. They are inexpensive, very compact and automatically reset. Go here and page down to see an example: http://www.members.optusnet.com.au/satr/battery.htm
Unfortunately, I don't see any of these in the Maplin online catalog. You could also use one of these: http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?ModuleNo=493 .

For a power connection, I use the 'standard' DC connectors like this:
http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?ModuleNo=1407 or this http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?ModuleNo=1416 as the receptacle mounted on the Stainz; it will provide power and can also be wired to break the circuit to the track power when the power plug is inserted. Then you need one of these:
http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?ModuleNo=43084 in the size matching the receptacle.

Regarding PWM (pulse width modulation), the voltage cycles rapidly between off and on, with the relative width of the off and on pulses determining the average voltage. Here's a good explaination: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulse-width_modulation .

_________________
Bill Wray

"It is one of the happiest characteristics
of this glorious country that official utterances are invariably
regarded as unanswerable."
-Sir Joseph Porter, First Lord of the Admiralty (HMS Pinafore)
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KleineDicke



Location : Deep in the Heart of Texas (Houston)

PostSubject: Re: RC/battery for LGB Stainz. Some advice anyone?    Tue Jan 11, 2011 4:52 pm

See my just completed post on battery conversion of my Spreewald.
http://continental-garden-t.motionforum.net/t818-battery-power-for-locos#10586

_________________
Bill Wray

"It is one of the happiest characteristics
of this glorious country that official utterances are invariably
regarded as unanswerable."
-Sir Joseph Porter, First Lord of the Admiralty (HMS Pinafore)
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Paulus



Location : The Netherlands

PostSubject: Re: RC/battery for LGB Stainz. Some advice anyone?    Tue Jan 11, 2011 4:53 pm

G-Scale Graphics Railboss and Critter Controls arrived today!!!! cheers

Now find me some time somewhere to work on it.... Sad

_________________
Paul pirat
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pjti



Location : Galizano, nr Santander, Nth Spain

PostSubject: Re: RC/battery for LGB Stainz. Some advice anyone?    Tue Jan 11, 2011 11:24 pm

Thanks Bill, I like the resettable fuse option, at least I have got an idea of what to look for. I am always a bit fazed by Maplins, so much stuff that "might come in handy" I nearly always forget what I actually went in for.

My all time fave is/was Tandy (aka Radio Shack). I miss them. I have my first multimeter - Micronta- bought it 38 years ago and it still works fine.

_________________
Wake me up by noon please.

Patrick
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KleineDicke



Location : Deep in the Heart of Texas (Houston)

PostSubject: Re: RC/battery for LGB Stainz. Some advice anyone?    Wed Jan 12, 2011 5:00 am

Radio Shack isn't what it used to be. They still sell some components and neat gadgets, but it's mostly overpriced except for the occasional sale. Actually, Maplin looks like my kind of shop.

_________________
Bill Wray

"It is one of the happiest characteristics
of this glorious country that official utterances are invariably
regarded as unanswerable."
-Sir Joseph Porter, First Lord of the Admiralty (HMS Pinafore)
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Carl Hibbs
Admin


Location : Haute Normandie - visitors welcome

PostSubject: Re: RC/battery for LGB Stainz. Some advice anyone?    Wed Jan 12, 2011 7:24 am

We have two excellent retailers here for components and more.

Conrad

Conrad also have a fair range of modelling including radio control.

Selectronic

Selectronic are generally better for electronic work.

Both offer fast mail order and very good service.

If anyone (not in France) wants anything I shall be happy to assist and forward items.
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Paulus



Location : The Netherlands

PostSubject: Re: RC/battery for LGB Stainz. Some advice anyone?    Sat Mar 19, 2011 7:35 pm

Well, kids and wife are away this weekend so I finally get me some time to work on it...

I changed my plan and build the G-ScaleGraphics RaillBoss ESC in a LGB/Toytrain boxcar (yes, you know the one). This because the Stainz was indeed to small to carry the batteries, ESC and receiver and still looks OK (you could stuff it all in the cab but you'll need some curtains to camouflage it.
Also, by creating a battery car with ESC I can use it on several different locomotives; just "plug and play"...

This afternoon I was wiring it all together but unfortunately I can't access the 'calibration mode' and the whole thing does not work... Sad
I checked and double checked and tried all possible ways; repeated the procedure with the other stick and with the servo switches in reverse and normal, without any result.

I mailed Del Tapparo from G- ScaleGraphics today and hopefully he can point out what I'm doing wrong. I hope it is just a simple thing...

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Paulus



Location : The Netherlands

PostSubject: Re: RC/battery for LGB Stainz. Some advice anyone?    Fri Mar 25, 2011 7:45 pm

Mailed with Del and all came clear.
I was right; I did not forgot one single thing... I just forgot three!!!!

I had totally overseen the 3 cables for the other channels... That's how far my check and double check validity goes... Rolling Eyes

After plugging in the cables calibration was a piece of gateau!

However.... just after the calibration disaster strikes; white smoke from the 5 Amp motor driver transistor that came loose from it's socket... affraid

Not sure how this could have happened. Anyway, the device don't work properly now. Del has offered it to repair for free / under warranty but postage costs are expensive (why is postage from the Netherlands to USA twice as expensive than vice versa...??)

So, I decided to repair the thing myself, hoping it's only the motor driver... as soon as I can find a similar one. Next week I'm planning to give the local electronics shop a visit.



_________________
Paul pirat
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Paulus



Location : The Netherlands

PostSubject: Re: RC/battery for LGB Stainz. Some advice anyone?    Sat Apr 02, 2011 5:17 pm

And YES! I've managed to fix the RailBoss controller!

cheers cheers cheers


Since I'm a bit of topic to my own post (since I did not build it in the Stainz but in a car) I decided to start a new topic about my experiences with this controller.

Look at My start with the RailBoss from G-Scale Graphics!

Paul
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Andrew



Location : Bomaderry, New South Wales, Australia

PostSubject: Re: RC/battery for LGB Stainz. Some advice anyone?    Sun Apr 03, 2011 5:31 am

Here is a photos of my modified Stainz with Hobbyking gear & batteries in the homemade tender. Photo was taken at Sandstone & Termite Railway. Also the wagons are made from scrap timber.
http://www.trainweb.org/SaTR/glatest.htm Ran for about 4 hours and still plenty of grunt left in the batteries Started at about 14 volts and at the days end was down to 12 .8 volts
10 AA x 3000 mAH Ni- MH rechargable batteries.
Cheers from Andrew
Sandbar & Mudcrab Railway
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Paulus



Location : The Netherlands

PostSubject: Re: RC/battery for LGB Stainz. Some advice anyone?    Sun Apr 03, 2011 9:33 am

I like that open top Stainz conversion a lot Andrew. The tender looks very good with it. Are you gonna use the tender with other locomotives also or is this a solid duo?
The cars look very nice also, any more detail pictures of those?

At this moment I run the train on a Ni-Hh 2300 mAh 9,6 Volts battery but perhaps I switch to a higher voltage to give it some more 'juice'.

_________________
Paul pirat
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Andrew



Location : Bomaderry, New South Wales, Australia

PostSubject: Re: RC/battery for LGB Stainz. Some advice anyone?    Sun Apr 03, 2011 11:03 am

The tender is biult from Masonite using the side frames from an Aristo lil critter. Small bolts at the rear on the top are used to connect clips to recharge batteries with out removing anything, this keeps it very simple to stop the train on siding, turn off esc and connect charger. All my locos have their own batteries either in the boiler or in the tender. Remember that Hobbyking eqiupment can only take 10 batteries max.
One Stainz has 8 batteries & hobbyking eqiupment in the cabin. They fit great if you remove the boiler backhead. I intend to paint everything in the cabin with black to hide the workings. The wagons are also made from masonite with steel wheels & basic chain links for couplings. simply washed with shellac. The pipes are pieces of conduit from an old electrical project. The coal carrier is filled with light weight foam then topped with crushed coal from the "Zig Zag Railway"
http://www.zigzagrailway.com.au/
The last van is made from cedar board ripped down on a band saw with the aluminium roof made from a take away container.
The Stainz in the photo was bought second hand at a club meet with the top removed. I have replaced the sand dome with a bachman dome & bachman smoke stack. The steam pipe in front of the cabin is from the smoke unit of a deceased LGB unit.
In the front on each side, just above the running board is a mounted headlight made from an electrical connector with the screw removed and an LED placed inside. They look great at night and use very little power. I intend to add Mylocosound eventually into the tender As there is plenty of room.
Cheers from Andrew
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Paulus



Location : The Netherlands

PostSubject: Re: RC/battery for LGB Stainz. Some advice anyone?    Sun Apr 03, 2011 3:49 pm

Quote :
Remember that Hobbyking eqiupment can only take 10 batteries max

THANKS FOR THE NOTICE!!! I did NOT know that so I guess you have prevented me for blowing up a reciever... Embarassed

Thanks for the further explanation on the rolling stock. Much appreciated.
Never thought of using masonite for building cars, must give it a try once because I have some left overs laying around.
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Andrew



Location : Bomaderry, New South Wales, Australia

PostSubject: Re: RC/battery for LGB Stainz. Some advice anyone?    Sun Apr 03, 2011 8:55 pm

Hello Paulus, you can have more batteries, if you have them installed in parallel which gives a greater capacity. If you install batteries in series you increase the voltage. But I found that 10 batteries seems plenty of power for what I run. I also have a aristocraft Lil-critter diesel which I fitted 10 batteries aristo revolution & mylocosound into. The trouble was that the speaker for the sound was so small that after removing windows to incease volume it became easier to move the instalation to a trail car with larger speaker & external volume control. With Aristocraft revolution you can have up to about 22 volts from memory, but i found that the higher the volts the more it would tend to shut itself down due to high heat. when I dropped the voltage down to 10 aa batteries it works very well. The reason I use hobbyking is the price. Each loco has its own remote, so every one who visits gets to drive a train. The cost would be prohibitive with the Revolution system.About $50au compared to $300au each foper loco
Masonite seems a good material to use if it is sealed but I dont try and run in medium to heavy rain as it might delaminate.
Cheers from Andrew
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KleineDicke



Location : Deep in the Heart of Texas (Houston)

PostSubject: Re: RC/battery for LGB Stainz. Some advice anyone?    Mon Apr 04, 2011 2:36 pm

Paul:
I have used the HobbyKing receivers with 12 NiMH batteries (14.4v) without any smoke or other problem. But I agree with Andrew; 10 batteries (12v) is plenty for a Stainz. 12v seemed insufficient for my Spreeewald and 14.4 was much better, but I have recently replaced the motor in the old girl, so I will likely try 12v again.

BTW, in my experience, Masonite doesn't stand up well in wet/humid climates. Literally thousands of homes in Houston (including mine) have had to replace the masonite siding due to "weathering". I hear tell you do get a little rain in Nederland.

_________________
Bill Wray

"It is one of the happiest characteristics
of this glorious country that official utterances are invariably
regarded as unanswerable."
-Sir Joseph Porter, First Lord of the Admiralty (HMS Pinafore)
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Paulus



Location : The Netherlands

PostSubject: Re: RC/battery for LGB Stainz. Some advice anyone?    Mon Apr 04, 2011 3:23 pm

KleineDicke wrote:
I hear tell you do get a little rain in Nederland.

Now THAT'S an understatement!!!


Thanks for the info about your experience with the batteries/voltage and the warning about masonite. You are right, the masonite can "soak up" moist like a sponge so perhaps it's not that good of a choice for me. Perhaps when it is sealed with lacquer or paint you can prevent this. But I also found out that the thinnest piece (I have) is about 3 mm thick, so still pretty thick for sidings. I guess I can better stick to my plastic sheets...
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Andrew



Location : Bomaderry, New South Wales, Australia

PostSubject: Re: RC/battery for LGB Stainz. Some advice anyone?    Wed Apr 20, 2011 10:15 pm

I have a problem with the Stainz "sandpaper sound". When the batteries are fully charged the sound unit works, but after about 30 minutes of running it goes from a chuff to a high pitch sqeak. Especially if I stop the running & start up again.
Any one have any ideas on the problem?

Andrew at the Sandbar & Mudcrab
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